This transcript was generated from an audio file by AI, and may contain inaccuracies.
Transcript
If Aaron Draplin wants to go off the record, he can go off the record. Hello and welcome to episode 145 of the erasable Podcast. I'm Andy Welfle. On head hosting duty tonight. I'm joined by my ever present cohorts and co hosts, Tim and Johnny. Hey guys. Hey. Hey.
Going.
So, as you all know, we three do not have extensive background in the visual arts and that's a topic we sometimes find ourselves neglecting on Erasable. So a little later when we get to the main topic, we're going to be joined by Tina Koyama, who is a stalwart in the Erasable Facebook community and in Field Nuts. She's also an urban sketcher and just a really, really talented artist. So we're going to learn all about the urban sketching movement and kind of what kind of gear works best. So before we do that though, let's, let's tackle tools, tools of the trade. So Tim, what are you, what are you consuming?
The first thing I'll mention is a documentary I just watched that is incredible. I really enjoyed it. It's a baseball documentary, but I think it's got a pretty universal appeal. It's called Koshien, Japan's Field of Dreams. And it's available, it was made and made available on espn. So if you have ESPN plus, like if you do that bundle with Hulu and Disney plus or whatever, you can watch it. And so Koshian is the name of a field and then there's a tournament in Japan. It's like a tournament named after that field. And it is the height is 4,000. High schools across Japan compete in a single elimination tournament called Koshian. And I listened to an interview with the director and she described it for Japan. This is like if Americans took March Madness and combined it with a Super bowl is like how big of a deal it is there. It's a bigger deal than pro baseball. And so they, this, this documentary follows two of the teams. I mean, they train year round to get ready for this tournament. And it's just a really fascinating glimpse into Japanese culture and Japanese baseball because they, they say that they, when, when baseball came to Japan, it, the only way for sports to make sense to the Japanese people was to turn it into an educational tool. So it was. So they, they did that. And so I mean, these kids that are on these teams, they have to dress a certain way, they have to address people a certain way, they have to learn about like how to carry yourself, your manners. They're picking up Trash on the sides of fields. I mean, it's just like really intense and really fascinating. So it follows two teams, like one legendary coach and one kind of up and coming coach. So it's, it's definitely worth watching. I really enjoyed that. I have been reading Jurassic park, the novel by Michael Crichton for the first time.
Oh yeah.
Because I'm going to be teaching it this year, which I'm super excited about. I have a new job at a, like a STEM high school, a tech high, sort of tech based high school here in East Tennessee. And so that is kind of a perfect fit for that type of school because it's. His books are so science heavy and, and also. But it's just a page turner. It's just a great book and I've never read it before and it is so good. It's blowing my mind. Like I'm just enjoying every, every page of it. So. Have either of you ever read Jurassic park?
Yeah, like 25 years ago.
Yeah. But I've just been tickled. Like while I've been reading it, I was like, this is so good. I just want to keep reading. And it's also like, there's just a lot there to think about. And it's. The movie's excellent, but I'm, I'm. I'm enjoying the book kind of as its own thing.
Yeah.
Which I mean, I haven't seen. Was great.
Yeah. I haven't seen the movie in, I don't know, 10 years or something too. So.
Yeah. Yeah.
And then the last thing I'll mention is that I've been reading the last few days a lot of poetry of Billy Collins.
Awesome.
I was drawn, I was drawn back to him. I heard him on. Cheryl Strayed, author of Wild, has a podcast through New York Times called Sugar Calling where she just calls people she's close with and has these like, kind of off the cuff conversations, you know, like, like a lot of those sort of like whatever you call like long format interviews. But it's. They're actually only like 30 minutes. But she talked to Billy Collins and it was so great and it was like, man, I need to get back to him. So I, I had about five of his books downstairs and so I started flipping through and. And then I actually went online and ended up buying his masterclass in reading and writing poetry.
Yeah.
That I haven't started yet, but I. Really excited about that. He's, he's wonderful and I love hearing him talk. So.
Yeah.
But yeah, that's, that's most of it. And I am writing with a Mitsubishi Hayuni and F. And I'm using a flagged by Ellen field notes. Oh, cool. Nice.
Johnny, how about you?
I finished that enormous Walt Whitman bio and learned a lot of stuff about Walt Whitman that was not as interesting as I thought it would be. And no mention of any of his stationary habits, which I found really disappointing.
Yeah. How dare they?
But I followed that up with that French novel called the Red Notebook, about a red moleskin that's in a purse that a guy finds. And he also owns a bookstore called the Red Notebook. So it was, you know, a cute little novel about Paris for a quick read.
There was no stationary in this. I'm gonna take the, like, hardest left turn I can to get back to stationary.
Only stationary.
The COVID of the book is a little cafe table with a notebook and a pen. Like, right on. This is what's up. I was saving it sold. Like, after I read something long, I'm gonna read this cute little book. But it was, you know, way too short and Amelie.
Ish.
In a good way. Yeah. No spoilers. And it was there. There's no adult situation, so Charlotte read it. She liked it, too. And I just watched one episode of the English game, which is about soccer, on Netflix. Have you guys seen any of the.
We've almost started it several times. Jane's parents loved it, and so we've been planning to, but just haven't yet.
Yeah, like, that novel, I've just kind of, like, had that in the hopper. Like, when things start looking crappy, I'm going to watch that show. And it was super enjoyable. And I think I mentioned Freud on here before. That show that's on Netflix, I think it's a German Austrian production. So it's all in German. And I'm really ashamed by how little I pick up. I have to use the subtitles, but it's so dark, like, ridiculously creepy. It's awesome. But I have to watch it late at night when everybody's asleep, because nobody wants to watch it. But there's a lot of good stationary in the background, which is cool. And in the first episode, you noticed that he had a lot of ink on his hand, even though he never held a pen. I thought that was a nice detail.
Yeah.
And I'll talk more about this later, but I'm writing in a vintage French school children's notebook and using an old and new single barrel 106 from Musgrave that matches the Musgrave shirt that I'm wearing right now. Actually have the Blue one.
Nice.
Yeah. How about you, Andy?
Oh, wow. So, Katie, I pretty, pretty quickly went through, you know, we love. We love, like, documentary television about food. And there's one that just hit Hulu. Actually, you know what? It just went off Hulu, so maybe I shouldn't even talk about it. But it's called Broken Bread. It's by the Roy Choi, who is that LA food truck chef who started Koji, which is that Kogi, that Korean taco truck, basically invented Korean tacos. He basically talked about, like, know, food and social justice. So he visited a, like a kitchen of a nonprofit that takes leftover food from, like, hotel catering and turns them into, like, you know, free, free meals for the homeless. He talks about, like, urban gardens. He talks about people who, like, use sustainable farming. Really, really good. If it's not, it just went off Hulu, so if you can find it, you should watch it. It's really great.
So you'll never be able to see it again.
Yeah, yeah. Um, we also have been getting through the latest season, the Crown, the one. The first one with Olivia Colman and Johnny. Have you. Have you watched it?
Yeah, yeah.
You didn't tell me that Larry Durrell is Prince Charles.
Yeah, yeah, he's really good.
Yeah, he's so good. And he's like, so different than Larry.
Yeah, he does a great job on the ground.
He does such a good job. At first I was like, oh, there's no way he'll be able to pull it off. Like, you know, Larry Durrell was really cocky and, you know, just kind, confident and kind of a womanizer. And Charles is just such a. Just like kind of snively and. No, I mean, I guess that's why they call it acting, because he did. He did a really good job.
That Charles heavy episode is my favorite ever of the show.
That's definitely my favorite. So good. I've learned so much about the history of Wales and kind of what it means when they call Charles the Prince of Wales and, like, how that happened. So, yeah, that was. That was a really good episode. Yeah. So. And then, you know, speaking of, you know, things on things on television, like every single other person on the planet, I watched Hamilton on July 4th when it came to Disney Plus. And, you know, I did. Did you two. Tim, you saw it, right?
I haven't seen it at all yet.
Johnny, did you. Do you have Disney? Do you have the house?
I forgot about it. I think my family watched it. I don't know what I was doing.
Yeah, I got to see it. On New Year's Eve Live, the San Francisco. Katie and I spent a crapload of money and went to go see it back when you could still go to big theaters with other people in it. And it was really good there. But you know what, you know, we were sitting on the upper balcony kind of toward the back and there's just so much detail that you miss when you're back there. And yeah, just like the, the close ups and the, the filming of it was, was super good.
Yeah, they did a great job. And I, I hadn't never seen it in person and I think I had listened there, you know, there are a few tracks that I knew really well off the soundtrack. And then I had listened through the whole thing maybe twice over the last couple of years, you know, and so a lot of them felt really fresh to me. There were, there are a couple moments throughout that just, I just, just keep kind of going through my head over and over again. Jane and I had the best time. We watched it over two nights because it's so long and we kept like, we kept trying to start it for a couple nights in a row, but we didn't, we couldn't start it until like 9:30. I was like, I'm not staying up until 1, so. Yeah, but man, so good, so good. I think my, I love that because I had no idea it was coming because I totally forgotten about it. But when Thomas Jefferson comes into it with that what did I miss? Song.
Yeah, yeah, so good.
Cracking up.
I. So I'm a big fan of the musical 1776, which is, you know, about sort of like the signing of the Declaration of Independence. John Adams is the main character and I, I really love how, how differently they. Hamilton in 1776 portrays these characters. Like, you know, Thomas Jefferson in 1776 is just sort of this like, you know, kind of like shy, dreamy writer who just doesn't really want to be there. He just wants to hang out with his wife and. Yeah, yeah. And by the time, you know, Hamilton, which takes place maybe 15, 20 years later, rolls around, he's just this like super cocky, like, oh yeah, everybody loves me, I'm a superstar. And he sings that what are you? What did I miss? Song. And yeah, yeah, it's. And, and then, you know, John Adams was, I mean, who was certainly obnoxious and obnoxious and disliked, as the song goes, in 1776 was like not, not present in Hamilton, but they refer to him a couple times.
Yeah, they say that like he doesn't have a real Job and he's the vice president.
Yeah, yeah, it's. It's so good. It was. Lin Manuel Miranda is just such a lyrical genius. And, you know, he certainly wasn't a one man show. Like, there were so many other people involved. Like, I. I think that. Yeah, Renee Lee Skolsberry is just like one of the most talented singers and actors just ever. She plays Angelica Schuyler. So, I mean, everybody's just really great. That's such a. Such a good show. So there's actually. I was reading some trivia about it and, you know, in the. No spoilers in the. The musical in Hamilton, sometime in the second act, Eliza has a song where she's burning a letter that Alexander wrote her and she's. She's singing and kind of like burning this letter and like putting it into a trash can. And apparently this is relevant to paper. Um, apparently they have this special, special paper that when you. When you light it on fire, it only burns for 2 minutes and 9 seconds, which is like the length of time it takes to like, get through the. That's part of the song. So then it has extinguished itself by the time the blackout happens. So it's not lighting it up. They can have a true blackout.
All right, so come on, come on. Field notes.
What?
Give us the. Give us the notebook that we can light on fire and It'll burn for two minutes, nine seconds, and then.
Yeah, that's. That's hilarious.
Edition number 45.
Terrible. Yes.
And I am. I am writing not in one of those pieces of paper, but in my Leuchtturm notebook with my. My Viking school pencil, My School by Latin or whatever it's called.
Oh. So I'm using a Leuchtturm right now. That's one of those Bauhaus ones, and it's yellow with black trim, which would match that pencil just right.
Nice.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah. I saw you when you switched to that. That looked really cool. Yeah. Fresh points. Let's switch over there. Tim, what are your. What are you up to in FreshPoints?
First thing I'll mention is. Kind of goes back to my. I kind of. I'm gonna say it now because I forgot to mention it when I was doing my consuming stuff, but about Billy Collins. And I might have talked about this a long, long time ago, but he is one of those writers that you can read his handwritten. You know, his handwritten drafts and stuff online because he's donated all of his. His papers to the University of Texas. And he's also on record saying what his favorite notebook is, which is just like my favorite thing to. To come across because he just has always. He always uses the same thing. And so he. I'll put it in the show notes. But he writes in pen, but he always uses, he says, a Uniball onyx, which is like one of those round, black barreled pencils that's kind of slim. He uses the Uniball onyx. And the notebook he uses are called Blue Line notebooks, which they're about like 8 bucks on Amazon, marked down from 10. So they're an inexpensive notebook, but they're hardback and they're like 7 by 9 inches. So it's from what I've seen and I ordered one, but I haven't gotten it yet. But it seems like it's going to be very similar to like those red and black notebook notebooks.
Yeah.
Because it's a. It's called like a hardback business notebook, which is so frigging stupid. That's called a business.
But for my important business, I gotta
do my business in this notebook. There's a lot of important business here. So. Yeah, so I just thought that was a fun little thing. And then you can go online and you can look up and I'll. I'll. Maybe I'll try to put this in the show notes. But you can look up scans like. Or photographs of his notebooks where you can see drafts of poems. Like when he wrote the. The names. The poem that he read at a joint session of Congress at the. At ground 0 for 911 that he was asked because he was poet Laureate at the time of 9 11.
Yeah.
Which is a wonderful, amazing, powerful poem. But you can see the drafts and how he, like, goes through his process and writes the poem. So. That's right. That kind of thing's always really fascinating. It's like those, those Walt Whitman ones you can read, which are of course better because it's Whitman and it's in pe.
But.
Yeah, but yeah, that's. It's pretty fascinating. So I just thought those notebooks would be a cool thing to point out if anybody's a Billy Collins fan. Curious about that. And they're called Blue Line Notebooks. Sorry. Blue Line Note Pro is what this one says. Blue Line Executive Journal.
Wow.
Blue Line Composition Business notebook.
God, I'm gonna need that.
Yeah, I already ordered one, so I'm, I'm so pro.
Like, I'm using school notebooks. This isn't right.
Yeah.
So you're Made in Canada.
Yeah.
So, yeah, there's that I am getting. So I mentioned that I got a new job, so I'm moving into a new school, and I don't have a classroom, which I think is great. I'm looking forward to that. That it's like an open. It's kind of an open format school. And so you're. You don't have a classroom, you don't have a. Your own office. It's just everybody's always in. Working in, like, a collaborative space, which I'm really looking forward to. So. But as far as desk space, they have, like, a long, like, bar, high table that all the teachers have a station at in the. In the workroom. And so I've just got a section, like, a little section of that table where all my stuff goes. And so I wanted you guys to give me some input on, like, sort of like a minimal setup, because I'm very dedicated to not having, like, a bucket of a million different pencils. Like, I literally want to choose, like, one kind of pencil, one kind of pen, and, like, just, like, be zeroed in because I'm going to be busy there and it's a new year, and I just don't want to be distracted by this stuff.
You should bring your. Your due, dick block. Yeah, so you're, like. You're going to be constrained by, like, the. You know, by the number of, like, holes that you can fit in that. Yeah.
And that's. I was actually. I was thinking about that because I've got two to choose from. I've got the one that I had him make that's, like a square one that has the notebook slot on the left, and then it has three pencils and three pens. And I was like, oh, cool. But then. But I also have the. The giant or, like, a bigger one that's like six pens and six pencils with the notebooks in the middle. But I. But if, like, I do that, I'm literally gonna put, like, six of the same pen, six of the same pencil, because I just don't want to. I just don't want to think about it while I'm there because it's just going to be a big transition. Yeah, but like, choosing one sharpener. Like, I want to have, like, a sharpener there, but I don't want to be. I don't want to ever be, like, in a situation where, like, should I use this or this? Because I just. I need to move and, like, get stuff done.
Yeah. Do you. Will you be, like, keeping your laptop there, like, docking it?
Yes. Yeah.
And do you have like an external monitor that goes there too?
No, it's just, I'm. It's just like a. They've got like the little shelf almost like above where you can like put your laptop and then like have your notebook down.
Okay, cool. That's a good question. I'm a big fan of a little desk felt pad or something like that. If you can find one that is the right dimensions for that space. That plus a little due deck block. And if you have a big notebook and a little notebook, just stack them on the side. Yeah, yeah, that's.
I think I'm going to use one of the. I have one of those Baron fig desk pads, like the smaller ones.
Oh yeah.
Huh. So I'm going to put one of those on there. And so for. That was what I was thinking for the pen as far as narrowing it down to just like a pen and pencil is. I'm. I think I'm just going to take some black wing naturals with me and that's, that's all that'll be. And then for pens I think I'm going to be using. I really like jet streams. So there's. I like those 1.0 jet streams, like the kind of fatter line. So I'm gonna take those and then I, I am going to take like a cup of the inner. What are they called? Papermate gel. Oh the ink choice inkjoy gel. The colored ones to use for like marking on stuff. So I'm gonna have like colored of those. I'm gonna have some jet streams and I'm gonna have some either blackling naturals or some. The 9852. Ew. I can't decide between those. It's gonna be one of those for the first round. This is like I'm gonna take six. I'm gonna take six men school.
Yeah.
I'm gonna take six pencils to work. When those six pencils are gone, I can change to a different pencil but I just don't want to think about it.
So if I were gonna go super minimal, I would take in like one or two four color pens from Bic and like a pack of mechanical Bic pencils and just be done. I know, boring.
You just got canceled, Johnny.
So there's a new Bic 4 color pen this year for the anniversary. It's purple and they got rid of the green ink for purple.
Oh yeah.
You're like oh yeah.
Get a link to that in show notes. I would.
I forgot where I bought it. But yeah, they're. They're cool. In person, it's more like indigo. But yeah, I would do like a pack of crystals and a pack of Ticonderogas. Especially if it's like out in the open, like, hey, people, I bought you some black wings.
Oh, yeah. No, it's not. Students. Students are nowhere near it, so. And I've only got like nine co workers. I'm not worried about that being close contact, but that I am going to take a fountain pen. Johnny. So Johnny's been. He has thrust me back into the fountain pen world I've been using.
That's right, Johnn Gamber.
He's gonna deny every. Every bit of it. But.
But outing you right now.
Prove it.
I've got.
I ordered.
Oh, I got texts. I got a text thread that'll light you up. It's got so many pictures of fountain pens. But I. So I've got. Our school colors are maroon and gray. And so I ordered one a Jinhao because we've been talking a lot about those, like, cheaper Chinese fountain pens. And some of them are knockoffs or whatever, which is like, got its own, like, ethical gray area there. But. But the Jinhao 992, which is gray and I'm loading it with maroon ink. And so I have that at school as well.
You got yours?
No, I didn't get it yet, but it's.
Oh my. Didn't come yet. Mine's still in China.
No, but that's. That's my plan. That's the one that's going to live at school. I'm just going to keep it there all the time, not going to take it home.
Awesome.
Yeah. So I'm dedicated to minimalism. I am going to take. So I cleaned out my classroom today to my old school and I had so many pencils, like, such an incredible amount of pencils at school. So I am still going to have like, I'm going to take a box and just like put it out for the students. Like, I'm just going to scatter them around the school for people to use because I got so many forest choice and right dudes and all these pencils that I had gathered to use in school. So I'm still going to take those, but I'm. I'm going to limit myself.
So I think someone posted in our group recently that the right dudes don't seem to be cedar anymore.
I haven't bought them in like two years, so I bought a huge amount.
That makes me sad.
That's a bummer.
Yeah, I'm glad I have a whole ton of them. I have a pencil box that's like bursting at the seams full of the natural ones because I love them very much.
Those are great pencils. Those are great.
Yeah. Let me know if you guys need like a dozen or two.
Okay.
That's all I've got. So that's. That's what's going on with me. How about you, Johnny?
So the only interesting things I have to talk about involve, like, handwriting lessons with my children and French ruled paper.
So that's all great. Yeah.
So have you guys seen the. I don't know how to pronounce it size, but French roll paper? S, E, Y, E, S. But they're accent marks.
Hmm.
But it's.
No, I don't think so.
So have you ever seen, like, how French cursive looks just, like, really cool and you're like, why does it look so neat? It's because of.
Oh, that's the, like, really tight rule where it's like, wider than it is tall, right?
Yeah. Or everything is like in thirds. So your lowercase letters are one third the size of your uppercase letters. And on the page it looks so cool. So I found a seller on ebay that had a bunch of them and I bought like 20 of them. They're not here yet. One is here. And, like, I'm really excited. It's really cool. And they're, like, really cheap. I can't imagine how much they cost when they were new notebooks. They're just like, sewn together. And the paper is amazing. You can use anything and it looks really good. So with, you know, being stuck at home, I want to do something useful this summer and my handwriting sucks, so I could do some practice. So we do handwriting lessons three or four times a week. So Charlotte has, like, mastered cursive and has like a whole slew of her own fountain pens. And now Henry, who's a lefty and not so good with printing, he's just kind of skipping it and moving on to cursive, which makes me very happy. So there's a lot of, like, ink and stuff all over the place here.
So.
Yeah, there's something about the way he writes. He has trouble with things that have a ball. Like the angle just doesn't work for him. So he likes pencils and, like, really wet fountain pens. Okay, that's cool.
Yeah, sounds great.
Yeah. So, yeah, he got one of those, like, Jinhao shark pens today. And he's, like, really excited he came in. What kind of ink can I have Whatever you want. And you know, I only have one kind of ink because I don't actually like fountain pens, so.
No, yeah, blue.
Yeah, sure, yeah, but it's, it's.
How many different blues do you have, Johnny Gamber?
5. No, wait, I'm a liar.
4.
There.
There you go.
Do you have a French, a French blue to put in your French ruled paper?
Waterman. An old Waterman reflex, which was like a school pen with Waterman blue in there. And it looks so good, it's so satisfying. But yeah, if you have kids that have ADHD and are left handed and terrible handwriting, this is a good time to work on it. And like, you know, he, he feels really good about it. He's like, I'm, he's so proud. He's like, cursive is the only way that's fun to write. Awesome. That's, that's very proud of the little boy. And tomorrow is Rosie's fourth birthday, which has nothing to do with anything but Happy bestial day, Rosie.
Oh, happy birthday, Rosie.
Yeah, she's very excited. She thinks she's getting a fountain pen. She is not. No, she actually likes to use. I have, I think I showed you guys. I have a pen cup that's a Bic crystal cap.
Yeah.
So it's full of like all the colors of bit crystals. That's what she likes to use.
Cool.
Yeah.
So how about you, Andy?
I just have one. So I moved apartments since I think last week we spoke. We basically in the same neighborhood in San Francisco. Just we moved down to the bottom of the hill. And really the best part about it is that it's two bedrooms. So Katie and I have kind of separate spaces for, for working and podcasting. And that just means that I had to sort of like briefly reconcile with my pencil collection in order to move it. So I did a little bit of pruning, but I, yeah, I've just been trying to find a better way to organize, organize my pencils. And really I just like, you know, at the moment I have several pencil cups around the house which, you know, is kind of the, what I call the Johnny Gammer method. But I also just have like, you know, boxes full of boxes of pencils in like one of those IKEA calyx cabinets, like the little square cubbies that they have. So. Really? Yeah, that's kind of how they remain. But I've, I've definitely taken, taken stock of the pencils that I, you know, have, have out and that I am using kind of regularly. So that's, that's that was a good. That was a good chance to do that. I have been hanging a lot of crap on the walls and I've. I've discovered as I'm sort of like, measuring where to put the hole and like, how to. How to hang it. I've. I've noticed that I have a use for my harder German pencils, and that is writing on the wall, just kind of like making a very. Just, just light mark on which, like. On which to, like, you know, hang a picture. So I've been using just a nice fabric, Estelle, to do that. So I. I typically, you know, prefer a slightly softer pencil. So like, I have all these, like, slightly harder pencils, and I just don't, like, like them that much. But that's a. That's a really good thing for when you're hanging. And then it erases pretty easily then, you know, once you got your. Your. Your hole hammered in there. So, yeah, that's. That's about it on my end.
Hey, Broken Bread is on Amazon Prime.
Oh, really?
How many seasons are there?
I think there's just one. Yeah, it's 10 episodes. Oh, nice. Okay. Yeah, go.
I think it's like six or seven or so. It's.
Yeah, six episodes, something like that.
Six. Yep. Six.
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, go watch it on Amazon prime if you have that.
Nice.
Cool. All right, do you all want to get Tina on the phone and talk about urban sketching? Yeah.
Yes, absolutely. Okay.
And now we are here with our main topic, and this is really exciting. We're talking to somebody who is just a major staple of the erasable Facebook group, and somebody who is multiple times contributed to Plumbago and is just a really, really kind, warm, welcoming member of the community. She's also an urban sketcher, which she's going to talk to us a little bit about, and somebody I had the pleasure of meeting when I was in Seattle about a year ago. So let's please welcome Tina Koyama. Hey, Tina.
Hello.
You know, this is, like, so thrilling to me. I can't believe I'm talking to you guys. Oh,
yeah, we, you know, Tina is one of, like, just the. The best kind of like, present friendly, friendliest faces within the erasable group. Um.
Aw.
Yeah, you do a lot of. And you, you know, you're really active in field notes. Excuse me, Field nuts. And I, we, you know, we just had Aaron Draplin on the last episode, and I. One of the. One of my favorite things is your giant photorealistic shirt of Aaron Draplin's Face
scary though, kind of, isn't it?
It is just like this big, giant, bearded, glaring guy on this. Just on your torso is really great.
Oh, yeah. And when I go like to an event, I part the crowd with that shirt.
I'm sure you do.
I believe it.
Yeah. So, Tina, you've been a pretty active group member for a while, but for those of us who may listen to the podcast and not and aren't in the group, can you tell us a little bit about yourself?
Sure. My background is all in writing. I got a master's degree in creative writing and I spent my career doing marketing writing for corporate America, basically, and then later as a freelancer. But so all my background is in writing and I didn't do very much creative writing after I got my degree, though. It was after that it was all just, you know, boring stuff.
Didn't you do. I feel like you told me once that you were a technical writer at Microsoft. Was that right?
Not a technical writer is marketing writer. Yeah.
Okay. Okay, cool.
Yes, I did. I did work there. Yes.
Cool. And what are you doing nowadays? I know you. You're pretty well known through the group for. For your sketches.
But yeah, yeah, I'm mostly retired, so it's cool. I mean, technically not, I guess. I mean, I still could do some freelancing, but really working sucks. I really like being retired.
Agreed. Yeah.
And also I know that you do some. You have your own blog and then you also guest blog on Ana's on well appointed desk, aren't you?
Yes, I am. And that's a lot of fun. Yes. And that's given me a lot of great opportunities and I love writing reviews anyway. And she lets me do pretty much whatever I want. I have a ton of fun doing that for her. Yes.
Awesome. So I sort of have a vague notion of what urban sketching is because it seems self explanatory, but could you give us the longish definition of this contemporary art phenomenon or your definition?
Well, the basic concept of urban sketching is not new. You know, people have been, you know, for. Artists have forever. You know, they're drawing and painting what they see. Painters call it plein air. So that part of it is not new at all. That's been going on forever. But traditionally, artists took those sketches that they did in the field and they brought them back to the studio to then turn into finished paintings, for example. So that's kind of always been the traditional concept of a sketch. And I think there's two important things that distinguish contemporary urban sketching from Other types of art. And both of these are part of the Urban Sketchers manifesto, in case you didn't know that. We do have a manifesto, so I put that in the show Links. Yeah. So the first thing is that everything is done on location and from direct observation. So not from photos, not from imagination. And this is kind of significant because there's. There are many, many artists who will do paintings from photos, but not us. And the other part that's tied into this is that the sketch itself becomes the end product. It's not something that gets refined later in the studio. So I think that's pretty distinctive for the Urban Sketchers as we're talking about it. And the second part of it, and this might be a little bit lesser known, but it's kind of the storytelling aspect. The person. I'll tell you a little bit more about him later, but the person who founded Urban Sketchers, Gabi Campanario, he is a journalist, and part of his impetus for urban sketching has always been that every sketch has a story to tell. And, you know, when I say, when I tell that to people about the story, you know, I don't mean, like, you know, a big story arc or, you know, a journalism story or anything like that. For me personally, the story might just be, you know, these trash cans are in the alley. So it must be Thursday in the Maple Leaf neighborhood. That's all it is. It's not like a huge deal or anything, but I guess the whole. The movement behind or the soul behind urban sketching is about that. That every time you make a sketch, you're telling a little story to whoever views it. So those are the two, I think, the important things that kind of make it distinctive from the old traditional definition of sketching.
Love that.
Oh, and then I do want to just say a little bit about Gabi. So Gabi Campanerio happens to live in Seattle, but he is the founding father of the Urban Sketchers movement. And this started out in a very. It was basically him. You know, he is a journalist for the Seattle Times, and he has a column in the Seattle Times. But when he started out, he was basically just drawing pictures in his neighborhood, and he was posting them all to his Flickr account. And, you know, this is back in 2007, when Flickr was kind of like social media sort of.
Oh, yeah, I loved Flickr back then.
Yeah. So he started noticing. He started looking around and started noticing that there were lots of other sketchers all over the world who were doing the same thing he was. And he Thought, wow, this is really cool. I want to see them all in one place. So he created a Flickr group called Urban Sketchers, and that's basically how the urban Sketchers movement began in 2007. And he started inviting all these sketchers that he saw online to post into that group. And that was really the beginning. And then now, you know, there's like, I don't know, tens of thousands of people worldwide who are doing all kinds of amazing things. So it really grew from there.
Nice. So for you in particular, what was it that drew you as an artist to urban sketching?
Well, you know, my whole life I saw myself as not a very visual person. I knew that I was a creative person, but not in visual arts and but my whole adult life, I really wanted to learn to draw. So, you know, I would read these how to books and sometimes I would go to classes and often I found them really boring. It'd be like, you know, oh, set up these boxes and make this still life, you know, or even in class they would pull out these really dusty looking vases that, you know, they got from some thrift store and they don't have any meaning for me. And I'm supposed to sit there and try. And, you know, I understood the, the reason why we had to study art that way, but it was super boring to me. And I kept quitting. I would draw for a little while, then I'd stop for a year, I'd do it again for a little bit, and then I stopped. I went through many, many cycles of this. And then nine years ago, I started hearing about this urban sketching thing. And then I started seeing just all these amazing sketches from all over the world. And all of a sudden it really just resonated with me. I thought, you know, this is something. It's about me, it's about my life. I get it. And the important thing there was I started practicing because I did had meaning to me. So it made me want to practice. And really the only way you become good at drawing is by practicing. So that's. I've been drawing every day since then.
So. Tina, that I. I like to think that, you know, when you're, you know, doing urban sketching involves sitting, you know, sitting in a coffee shop watching people. But I know that you've also, you know, like, in some of the, like, erasable video calls that John Morris has organized, you know, you. You're sitting, watching, you know, watching your screen and drawing the people on the screens. So, like, what Generally, like broad themes. What does an Urban sketching session look and feel like,
well, you know, in the winter, I mean, you know, the good sketching weather in Seattle is very short. So a lot of the winter, and when it's pouring rain or cold, I am in coffee shops. And I also go out a lot in my car. You know, I can just sit in my car and sketch sometimes I do a lot of that in the bad time of year. But, like right now, during this short, beautiful season, I like to be outside as much as I can.
So
I guess I'll call it. My principle of urban sketching is that I don't have a separate sketch kit. My sketch kit is an integrated part of my everyday carry. And the reason that's important to me is because I want to be able to sketch wherever I am. So, you know, back in the day when we used to actually go somewhere, I might actually be going somewhere or on the way home from something, and then I see something, I can just pull over and get out of my car and start sketching. I don't have to say, oh, rats, I forgot my sketch kit at home, or whatever it is. It always is a part of my daily carry. So that's kind of an important principle that I like to have. And the second thing is, I mean, if you want to visualize me out there, I don't like to sit. I know a lot of sketchers who like to bring along a little stool or folding chair or something, you know, And I know I have some friends who have those big old chairs with the, you know, the cup holders and the handle, and they, you know, they carry all the stuff around. And that's great if you. If you want to do that. But I don't like to. I like to really, you know, pack light.
So.
And I like to be on my feet when I sketch. So everything I bring has to be really portable. And I like to just leave my bag on my shoulder and, you know, stand wherever I want and do it. And, you know, who knows, I might need a quick getaway in case somebody doesn't like where I'm standing or who knows? But anyway, I just wanted to give you kind of the picture, so that's kind of what I look like. I'm always just on my feet.
Nice.
Cool.
So where does urban sketching fit into the sphere of contemporary art? Like, is it showing up in galleries and shows besides just Instagram and social media?
Yeah, there are lots of the local urban sketchers groups. So Urban Skechers as a network is made up of, you know, many Many small groups all over the place. Each city might have one or, you know, just based on the geography. And there are lots of these local groups who, they sponsor their own exhibitions, for example. And then a lot of urban Skechers are also professional artists. And so they're putting their sketches up in, you know, up on gallery walls just like any other, you know, paintings on canvases. So really, I think it's not, it's not too far away from regular art. It's just, it's just that people don't think of it that way, but it is.
So every art movement has its heroes. So who are some urban sketchers our listeners should follow? Maybe people that you follow regularly or somebody you always keep up with that you think is a good touchstone for the, for the genre.
Oh, wow. Oh, I didn't prepare a list. I have a, I have many, many people that I like to follow. Suhita Shroudikar is one that I would say she's, she lives in San Jose. She's an instructor for Urban Sketchers. And one of the things that she, she, I guess I would say my heroes, my urban sketching heroes are the ones who can sketch anywhere, anytime, under any situation. She'll never say no to anything. So I would say she is one. Oh, gosh, I wish I'd. I will probably have like more names in, in the show notes if you want. Yeah, I, I will do that because I, I didn't really think about that.
Oh, no worries. Well, I would love to talk about, you know, this is a, a show about pencils and paper and, and tools after all. Really love to talk about your gear. Can you maybe give us like a quick list of what's in your specific kit in your particular edc? And then we might like, have some more questions about like, the characteristics of, of these, of what makes a good urban sketch.
Sure. Yeah. Oh, yeah. My favorite topic is talking about tools. My basic kit is just a sketchbook and colored pencils and a marker. Usually those are kind of my basic things. And then depending on my mood or kind of seasonally, because I tend to be more color oriented in the summer, spring, those months, and then in the winter when everything's kind of gray, then I kind of go more into graphite or more monochrome. So depending on the season or my mood, I'll put different things in. But the basic kit is always colored pencils, a sketchbook, and the marker. So that's kind of the high level
it seems like you often have. It looks like a white gel pen but maybe it's a white colored pencil because it seems like you always have some nice white accents on colored paper.
Yes, yes, yes. That's specifically I kind of have when I'm sketching in my red sweet tooth. I do have. Yes. The black marker I use there and then the white gel O pen. Those, those are kind of the two together. Yeah.
Cool.
So speaking of sweet tooth, what are some good papers or notebooks or things on which you draw that you like to use for urban sketching?
I guess I have two basic sizes. My main sketchbook is, is a soft cover Stillman and Byrne sketchbook, which it's about a 5ish size, I guess. And that's kind of like the one that I use color in. And you know, if I have some time, if I have like at least a half an hour to sketch, I'll use that. But then like I also carry always a pocket sized one, like a sweet tooth usually or sometimes I use those unrolled signatures. And you know, I also carry an expedition sometimes, like on a rainy day I take my expedition out there because it's the only thing that you can write on in the rain. And I have sketched in that too. That size is so perfect because it's very discreet. Like if you pull that out on a bus or in a coffee shop, people just think you're taking notes. They never pay any attention. Well, they never pay attention anyway. Even if they were to look and I had a bigger sketch, I could probably pull out a whole easel and nobody would pay attention. Everybody is just so focused on their own phones or their devices. Nobody is ever. Look, I have, I just want to say this. I have never, ever, ever yet been caught or at least nobody has ever confronted me about sketching. And part of that is just I have this, a small sketchbook for in that situation because I like to be discreet. So those two sizes get me through everything.
Nice. And you mentioned colored pencils. But like a. As far as just pencils in general, what makes them a great tool for urban sketching?
Oh, well, let's see. Well, I'll just say my favorite pencil, my most versatile pencil for anything is the Blackwing mmx. Because I can do, I can write with that all the time. I write notes with that, but I also sketch with it a lot. So that would be kind of my most versatile, you know, everyday use kind of pencil. I also love high unis. And as a general category, I really, really love ridiculously soft graphite. I mean, like I have this right now. I'M using the Staedtler Mars lumograph in 12B.
12B.
12B. Yes.
Sounds like you need a cup to carry that around.
Just about. Yes. And then you know that tombow km kks in 6b. Oh, love that one. And then there's a. Yeah. And then the high uni in 10B. Love that one too. So that whole. I always switch those out. Lots of different ones. I'll switch out in my bag. And then there's. Oh, there's one by Biarco called Artgraph and it's a water soluble graphite. I love that one too. So did you ask me if. Why they were good for sketching? Is that the question or was that.
I guess I'd be interested to know, like. Yeah, why? Because. Is it because it's soft or is it because it's smooth or because you can smear it? Like, why do soft contacts? Yeah.
Oh, it. Yeah, I think it's. It's very expressive. You know, you can just. I will sometimes just use it from the side. Like I'll have the side of the lead and not the point. So you can get a really broad stroke with it. And you know, like, if you use something like that, like a 6B or a 12B or something like that on the expedition paper, it is amazing. I know people are always saying, oh, but doesn't it smear? Yeah, it does smear, but it is so amazing. It looks like a marker. It makes such a dark mark on that expedition paper and boy, it's like skating on butter. That's not the right. That's probably a mixed metaphor. But you know, it's really, really nice. Yeah.
Do you. Do you find yourself sharpening a lot when you do this? Like, do you prefer like a long point or a short point or. And also, do you like, erase. What kind of accessories are you using?
Oh, well, yeah, the colored pencils I keep sharp a lot. And I use this little. It's the little two hole brass M R. And that's mainly because the hole is one of the holes in. That fits my favorite colored pencils, which are the Caran d' Ache Museum Aquarewells. And the barrel is a tiny bit larger than standard pencils, so it's hard to find a sharpener that fits that. So anyway, I do keep my colored pencils pretty sharp graphite. I don't really mind that much when it gets dull because when I'm drawing because it's. It's really more. You know, I'm trying to actually avoid getting too Picky with little tiny details and stuff because, you know, I don't want to be there for five hours. So I'm trying not to be that pointed. I would rather be a little bit dull. In that case, Eraser. Oh, well, eraser. Okay. I don't have anything against erasing, but I really. But I don't erase when I'm sketching because I don't. I think the sketch becomes much more lively when your original line is still showing. So, you know, I might do some lighter lines to begin to kind of just frame the picture and see what it is I'm trying to compose. But then I get darker and darker and darker and I leave the lighter lines underneath and I don't take them away because I feel like that's all kind of part of the process. And so much of urban sketching, at least for me personally, is about the process. Excuse me. And not coming up with this finished thing. That looks perfect.
Yeah, yeah. I was going to say, Tina, the show is called Erasable. You have to erasing somehow.
Oh, well, if we want to talk about erasers, you know, I have this whole review on Anna's blog about hacking up black wings. Hacking up erasers for black wings. I hate black wing erasers. They do not work. And I hacked up about, I don't know, 10 different kinds of erasers. It's the Tombow Mono Smart is the best eraser for if you want to hack it and put it on the end of your, your black wing. Because it has to be the right balance between, you know, how a soft eraser is usually better. Right. It erases better, but if it's too soft, it's going to break off inside that ferrule. So I did a lot of experimenting and that Tombow Mono Smart is the best.
That's interesting. Were you the one who did it with the Koh I Noor magic eraser and made just that cool swirled rainbow eraser?
No, I think that was Anna. Yeah, she did a big rub off where she tested a whole bunch of erasers.
Yeah, that particular eraser was too, too like crumbly to be a good, like hack wing eraser. But it looks so good.
Yes. Yes. That is cool.
Yeah.
Awesome. So you mentioned adverse weather conditions in Seattle. And I mean, like today I'm super jealous of the weather you're probably experiencing, but what are some of the, like, harshest weather conditions you've sketched in?
Well, I don't know how. Maybe by, you know, eastern standards this really isn't that harsh. But I Have sketched in snow. And, you know, in Seattle, when it snows, it's not like, super duper cold. It might only be like 35 or something like that. So, you know, I just put on a down jacket and a hood, and it's really not that bad if I have. I have good fingerless gloves, so. And again, the expedition was really good. I mean, there was actual snow flakes coming down out of the sky, and they just kind of land on the book and then. And if you have a pencil, so you can't. You can't do it with pen. See, this is where, you know, people are always talking about what kind of pens write on the expedition. Well, they're fine to write on dry, but if you try to write with a pen on a wet exposition page, nah, it just slides right off. Right. But on the other hand, a soft graphite pencil, it'll just. You can write on it wet or dry. It's fantastic. So that's my recommendation if you plan to sketch in adverse weather.
Noted. So over your time doing this, and also just being a fan of urban sketching, what are some of your favorite urban sketches? This, I mean, could be ones that you've done or ones that you've seen. Just ones that stick out as kind of great examples or just ones that have a good meaning or story behind them that's special to you.
Wow. So many. I guess I can't think of one particular one, but I do kind of have a broad category of what I. What always attracts me the most. And those are the ones that are about just ordinary people's streets and alleys and neighborhoods. You know, like, I think about how. Okay, so if you. If you are an urban sketcher and you went to Paris, well, of course you have to sketch the Eiffel Tower, right? And I did. I went to Paris, and of course, I sketched the Eiffel Tower. But then to me, the ones that became much more meaningful to me later, and then also when I look at other people's sketches are the ones of just the parts that you never see. You never even see photographs of, because it's where people live. The back alleys, you know, the antennas, the laundry is hanging out behind there's trash cans. That's the kind of stuff I really love to see of other people's sketches. And that's the kind of sketching I like to do when I travel, because that's where all the real people are living, not where all the tourists are hanging out. And that really, it always resonates with me. And, you know, sometimes people will say, you really like trash cans, don't you? Well, it's not so much that I like trash cans so much, but to me, this is, you know, this is where people live. Everybody has trash, and it's Thursday, and we put it out in the alley. And I think that tells a lot more than come to Seattle and see the Space Needle. Right.
Come to Seattle. We got trash.
Exactly.
Well, Tina, that's awesome. Last question for you. How can. So, you know, people who are interested in what you're saying but just may not know much about it, how can people get into urban sketching?
Well, if you're interested in the organization Urban Sketchers, the global organization, it would be urbansketchers.org and there's a lot of resources there. There's workshops, how you can find a local group. All that stuff is on that blog. And there's a lot. It's amazing. A lot of information as well as people sketches and lots of resources there. If you mean just the act of urban sketching that, you know, get your
butt outside and start doing it, that
is exactly it, you know, and people both in field nuts and erasables sometimes will contact me and say, oh, Tina, I love what you do. You've really inspired me. I want to do this. You know, what kind of pencil should I get? Or whatever. There's. There's kind of a lot of focus on materials. And I understand that because I'm a total material junkie, too. But I would say that the best advice to give anyone who wants to do it is to use whatever you're already comfortable with, because you don't really want a whole nother hurdle to get over, like learning how to, you know, use something. I mean, when I first started urban sketching, I looked around at all the other urban sketchers, and everybody was using watercolor. And I thought, oh, okay, I guess everybody. That's what I need to use, because that's what everybody else is doing. And because I like to stand up, it became this real struggle to juggle holding my watercolors and water and all this stuff when I'm standing up. And one reason that I switched to pencils and colored pencils was because of that hurdle. And again, I think if you are using something that you're already comfortable with, then just focus on the sketching and not worry about the materials. That would be my advice.
Yeah. Is there. I feel like we had Vivian Wegner on, like, maybe a couple years ago, and I can't remember Did y' all go. Was there, like, a convention that y' all went to?
No, I didn't. I didn't go to one with her. But there is. There is. Every year, there is an urban sketcher symposium in a different city around the world.
Oh, cool. Okay. Yeah, I just remember somebody posting pictures from that just looked really, really interesting. Yeah.
Yeah. Sadly, not this year.
Yeah, that is true. Well, Tina, thank you so much. Is there anything that we. That we didn't cover that you'd like to talk about?
No, I thought this was great. You know, you guys have. I just love listening to you guys every time, and it's. So you have great guests, and you always inspire me to just keep using my pencils. And I learned so much. You know, I'm very colored pencil focused, and I don't. I'm not that graphite focused, but I always learn a lot. And somehow, despite not being. I say I don't use graphite as much, but. Well, I got a lot of pencils, so I've been paying attention to you guys. And what was that? Oh, oh, look at. There's a show note. Oh, click, click.
Well, for sure.
Like, we.
We definitely recognize that, you know, the three of us all use pencils in kind of the same way, mostly for writing. So, you know, visual art is definitely a big. A big weak spot. So whenever. Whenever we have, like, you know, Anna on or you or somebody talking about. Talking about art, it's always, like, hugely popular. So it's definitely something we should. We should definitely be doing more often.
Oh, good.
Yeah. Tina, if people wanted to follow your. Your art and just follow you on the Internet, how. How could they do that?
My blog is Fueled with Clouds and Fueled with Clouds and Coffee. Fueled by. Sorry, I didn't get mine. Fueled by Clouds and Coffee. And I'm on Instagram as Miata Girl. That's M I A T A, like the car and G R, R L. It's a very 90s name because my Miata is a 96 and I'm still.
Do you still have your Miata?
Oh, yeah, yeah, I still drive it. Yeah.
Yeah. That's really fun. Well, thank you, Tina, so much for taking the time and coming on the show and sharing with us. I appreciate it and being such a
great, active member of our group.
Yeah, sure. Yeah.
Thank you.
Yeah, thank you. People to interact with. Yeah.
Well, my dream is to meet all of you someday. I did meet Andy a couple years ago, and I really want to meet Tim and Johnny, too.
Come on, guys, get thee to Seattle.
Yeah. I won't leave. Cool. Can I come?
Johnny, how can people find you on the Internet?
I am occasionally@pencilrevolution.com and on social media Ensolution.
Cool.
And Tim, you can follow me on Twitter timwassom and I'm on Instagram timothywasom.
Awesome. And I'm Andy. I'm on Instagram and Twitter as wellfli and you can find my blog@woodclinch.com and this is the Erasable podcast. We are on the web @erasable us. This is episode 145, so you can find the recording and show notes. At erasable US 145 you can come hang out with us and with Tina in our Facebook group by going to facebook.com groups erasable, we're about 5,4300ish members strong. And you can check out, you can check us out on Facebook and Twitter and Instagram, all raceablepodcast. And also if you feel so moved, we have a Patreon and we would love your support. You can go there and just, you know, find plenty of different levels to support this show and get extra content. And speaking of which, we have people who contribute at the producer level. I will thank here. So thank you so much to Alex, Jonathan Brown, Anne Sipe, Bob Ostwald, Bobby Lutzinger, Chris Jones, Chris Metzkis, Chris Ulrich, Dave McDonald, Dave Tubman, Fourth Letter Gangster Hotline, Hans Noodleman, Hunter McCain, Jacqueline Myers, James Dominguez, James Speer, Jason Dill, Jay Newton, Jamelia Joe Crace, John Bannon, Johnny Baker, Karen Peabody, Kathleen Rogers, Kelton Wiens, Leslie Tuzou, Mary Collis, Measure Twice, Michael d', Alosa, Mike Hagen, Millie Blackwell, OA Pryo, Random Thinks, Stuart Lennon, Tana Feliz, Terry Beth Ledbetter and Think Travel Eat. Thank you so much and we will catch you in a couple of weeks. Do you like our podcast? Most people like our podcast, but if
you like our podcast, maybe we'll turn it off.